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New UPS Part-time Insurance


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#1 GrandmaV

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Posted October 27 2007 - 07:46 AM

I am a part-time package clerk. I have worked for UPS (hour wise) 29 years. I will retire shortly after the contract takes effect. My concern right now is the health insurance. The new contract states: "Part time employees covered by a Teamster Health and Welfare Fund will continue to be covered by those funds.

....effective January 1, 2008 health and welfare coverage for all part-time employees on the payroll at that time and those hired thereafter will be provided health care under the UPS National Health Plan for Part-Time Employees (with a prescription card).

My concern is which am I? I thought if you were on a union covered job and paid dues you would be part of the Teamster Health and Welfare Plan and non-union would be on the UPS National Health Plan. Now I'm not so sure. I may be retiring in a year but my health benefits may change in January. This may determine whether I vote yes or no. I need to know exactly what is going to happen to my benefits. Does anyone know? :smile::

#2 TheVoice

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Posted October 27 2007 - 08:03 AM

I am a part-time package clerk. I have worked for UPS (hour wise) 29 years. I will retire shortly after the contract takes effect. My concern right now is the health insurance. The new contract states: "Part time employees covered by a Teamster Health and Welfare Fund will continue to be covered by those funds.

....effective January 1, 2008 health and welfare coverage for all part-time employees on the payroll at that time and those hired thereafter will be provided health care under the UPS National Health Plan for Part-Time Employees (with a prescription card).

My concern is which am I? I thought if you were on a union covered job and paid dues you would be part of the Teamster Health and Welfare Plan and non-union would be on the UPS National Health Plan. Now I'm not so sure. I may be retiring in a year but my health benefits may change in January. This may determine whether I vote yes or no. I need to know exactly what is going to happen to my benefits. Does anyone know? :smile::



Granny,

Good question. I brought up this same language myself…and quite frankly, the response I got was not clear…so with that, I think you should vote no. As far as I am concerned this language needs to be cleaned up…it is vague, and we all know who benefits from most vague language in the contract (usually), the company.

As far as I am concerned, even if it is explained to you appropriately, as was attempted with me, it needs to be cleaned up, so that it is clear and precise.

I hope that things work out for you, and that you enjoy your retirement…you deserve it, congratulations.

Respectfully,

The Voice

#3 GrandmaV

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Posted October 27 2007 - 12:49 PM

Thanks, I was going to retire this past Oct 1 but found out I was only going to be paid for 25 years. Have to continue working until I have 750 hours next year.

I am really concerned about this insurance thing. I know I will only get $55 per year of service instead of the $60 but I'm not concerned about that. I'm concerned about the insurance starting in January 2008. I have been perfectly happy with what I have had and really do not want to change unless I can get more information on this UPS National Health Plan for part-timers. I'd like to know who the part-timers are that are in the Teamster Health Plan if not part time union members.

#4 TeamsterOne35

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Posted October 27 2007 - 04:17 PM

Here in Indiana part-timers and full time employees are under a UPS health plan. We are members of Local 135 (not every UPS member in Indiana is part of our Local) and our pension is with the Local 710 pension plan.

We were transferred to Local 135 from Local 710 in 1986, but our pension remained with 710.

#5 GrandmaV

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Posted October 29 2007 - 10:34 AM

I just got some information on the new UPS National Health Plan for Part-timers. Looks better that what we have now. 100% on vision, etc. Thing is, it says in network. How do we know if our doctors are in network? I have a call in to the uion hall to ask questions, but really don't think they will be able to answer them. I'm really more confused than I was before. I thought I was going to vote against the contract but now I'm not so sure. And, what is this 90% out of area????? It says $10 copay/90% out of area. What the heck is that?

#6 cousin tim

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Posted October 29 2007 - 11:14 AM

GrandmaV, I suggest you wait to hear from your local. If they don't know the answer, the can find out.

Contrary to what the Voice says, you should not simply vote no if you don't understand everything in the contract.

Wait to find out if your needs are addressed in the contract, then decide.

#7 asdf

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Posted October 29 2007 - 11:40 AM

GrandmaV, I suggest you wait to hear from your local. If they don't know the answer, the can find out.

Contrary to what the Voice says, you should not simply vote no if you don't understand everything in the contract.

Wait to find out if your needs are addressed in the contract, then decide.


There's so much wrong with thisIMO, this type of selfish thoguht process is exactly what divides us. If the contract benefits you and rapes most everyone else, it's OK. Vote yes.

Wonderful!
"...the man who really counts in the world is the doer, not the mere critic-the man who actually does the work, even if roughly and imperfectly, not the man who only talks or writes about how it ought to be done."

#8 cousin tim

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Posted October 29 2007 - 11:50 AM

There's so much wrong with thisIMO, this type of selfish thoguht process is exactly what divides us. If the contract benefits you and rapes most everyone else, it's OK. Vote yes.

Wonderful!

Good point. I could have expressed that better.

GrandmaV basically indicated her vote depended on the answer to this question. That was all I meant by my last sentence.

#9 TheVoice

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Posted October 29 2007 - 12:40 PM

GrandmaV, I suggest you wait to hear from your local. If they don't know the answer, the can find out.

Contrary to what the Voice says, you should not simply vote no if you don't understand everything in the contract.

Wait to find out if your needs are addressed in the contract, then decide.



Brother Tim,

I didn’t mean to come across that Granny should vote No, without finding out the answer, or simply if she did not believe it or understand it, perhaps I can put it in better words…

Read my statement again, what I was trying to say, in so many words is, things are always going to be explained away by the people that are trying to sell it (including you and me), but if you come across still as confused as you were before, chances are, the language is to vague…indeed, she should try to find out the correct answer from as many qualified people as she can, including other union brothers and sisters.

The problem with weak language is, if it’s to weak to understand, the company usually benefits. This is all legal language, each side trying to make it as sharp for their side as possible, and the sharper the opposing sides language, the more vague you want to make your side. The purpose of this is that a window can be created so that at a later date you can challenge the meaning of what has been implied. It appears that is what is going on here, I cant be for sure, but I have had enough people question that part of the contract to be concerned about how its worded.

But your right, simply not understanding something should not constitute a No vote, there are other factors that should come in to play. Fair enough?

Respectfully,

The Voice

#10 Wonka

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Posted October 30 2007 - 06:09 PM

I am a part-time package clerk. I have worked for UPS (hour wise) 29 years. I will retire shortly after the contract takes effect. My concern right now is the health insurance. The new contract states: "Part time employees covered by a Teamster Health and Welfare Fund will continue to be covered by those funds.

....effective January 1, 2008 health and welfare coverage for all part-time employees on the payroll at that time and those hired thereafter will be provided health care under the UPS National Health Plan for Part-Time Employees (with a prescription card).

My concern is which am I? I thought if you were on a union covered job and paid dues you would be part of the Teamster Health and Welfare Plan and non-union would be on the UPS National Health Plan. Now I'm not so sure. I may be retiring in a year but my health benefits may change in January. This may determine whether I vote yes or no. I need to know exactly what is going to happen to my benefits. Does anyone know? :shock::


GrandmaV, your situation illustrates a serious problem confornting all of us. You've been a member for 29 years, yet you don't know if your health care coverage comes via a Teamster based health and welfare fund or from a UPS employer based fund. I sincerely don't mean to belittle you in any way but it simply boggles my mind you don't already know this.

I see that you are from Local 554 and might live in Kansas, Nebraska, or Iowa. Unfortunately, I do not know which supplement you are covered under.

You should call your local union and ask these questions: CURRENTLY, am I covered by a Teamster plan or a UPS plan? (if you are covered by a Teamster plan, you will continue to be covered by that plan under the proposed agreement. If you are covered under the UPS plan, you will be moving to the new national UPS plan for part timers.)

The new national plan offers many part-timers an improved benefit (although in some areas of the country, part-timers lose benefits compared to what they had in their own supplement). But there are many holes in the proposal. For instance, I've spoken to Teamsters all over the country and can't find anyone who knows what the network is. Is it the Blues (Blue Cross, Blue Shield), is it Aetna or United Health or Coventry or WHAT? Until you know what the network is, you won't be able to tell which docs and medical facilities in your own area belong to the network. This is more than a LITTLE important. If no network is available where you live (which suggests that this is not a BLue Cross/Blue Shield netwrok since that is generally recognized as having nationwide coverage) than the benefit pays the 90% referred to in the SPD.

Another major hole in the proposal: the current proposed language does not restrict UPS from changing any of the benefit levels described in the SPD. A $10 doctor visit could be changed six months from now without recourse. What might look like a good plan now might go south quickly and there's no provision in the proposed agreement to stop a change.

For my $, this is just one of a number of examples indicative of the IBT's rush to ratify that left gapping holes in the agreement that will hurt the membership over time. Items haven't been thought through, or thoroughly explained, prior to the vote. People already have their ballots, but they also have questions they can't get answered. This is a recipe for disaster.

#11 ArmyOfOne

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Posted October 31 2007 - 02:53 AM

GrandmaV, your situation illustrates a serious problem confornting all of us. You've been a member for 29 years, yet you don't know if your health care coverage comes via a Teamster based health and welfare fund or from a UPS employer based fund. I sincerely don't mean to belittle you in any way but it simply boggles my mind you don't already know this.

I see that you are from Local 554 and might live in Kansas, Nebraska, or Iowa. Unfortunately, I do not know which supplement you are covered under.

You should call your local union and ask these questions: CURRENTLY, am I covered by a Teamster plan or a UPS plan? (if you are covered by a Teamster plan, you will continue to be covered by that plan under the proposed agreement. If you are covered under the UPS plan, you will be moving to the new national UPS plan for part timers.)

The new national plan offers many part-timers an improved benefit (although in some areas of the country, part-timers lose benefits compared to what they had in their own supplement). But there are many holes in the proposal. For instance, I've spoken to Teamsters all over the country and can't find anyone who knows what the network is. Is it the Blues (Blue Cross, Blue Shield), is it Aetna or United Health or Coventry or WHAT? Until you know what the network is, you won't be able to tell which docs and medical facilities in your own area belong to the network. This is more than a LITTLE important. If no network is available where you live (which suggests that this is not a BLue Cross/Blue Shield netwrok since that is generally recognized as having nationwide coverage) than the benefit pays the 90% referred to in the SPD.

Another major hole in the proposal: the current proposed language does not restrict UPS from changing any of the benefit levels described in the SPD. A $10 doctor visit could be changed six months from now without recourse. What might look like a good plan now might go south quickly and there's no provision in the proposed agreement to stop a change.

For my $, this is just one of a number of examples indicative of the IBT's rush to ratify that left gapping holes in the agreement that will hurt the membership over time. Items haven't been thought through, or thoroughly explained, prior to the vote. People already have their ballots, but they also have questions they can't get answered. This is a recipe for disaster.



Take note that the language regarding those part-timers staying in a Teamster plan DOES NOT say for the "life of this agreement." Furthermore, reading the next paragragh it say that "all" part-times will be placed into the national plan AND that THIS paragraph will "SUPERSEDE" any similar language in any supliment, rider, or addendum. Anyone care to explain what they think this means means?

#12 mjmccarthy

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Posted October 31 2007 - 05:09 AM

Take note that the language regarding those part-timers staying in a Teamster plan DOES NOT say for the "life of this agreement." Furthermore, reading the next paragragh it say that "all" part-times will be placed into the national plan AND that THIS paragraph will "SUPERSEDE" any similar language in any supliment, rider, or addendum. Anyone care to explain what they think this means means?

Another example why this garbage is being sooooo rushed to vote.

we are getting screwed royally
They who would give up an essential liberty for temporary security, deserve neither liberty or security......Ben Franklin

#13 GrandmaV

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Posted November 01 2007 - 06:19 PM

I received some information in the mail today. A big copy of the UPS Health Care Dispatch for Part Timers. Everything looks good until you read this: If the information shown in this newsletter differs from this Summary Plan Description (SPD), the SPD will govern.
That tells me that if this contract is ratified, our insurance will move to a plan which may be completely different than what they presented to us before ratification. So, let's see, we do not know what network we'll be under or even if the network will be a local one.
We don't know if our doctors will be part of the network. And to top it all off, we may not have the same insurance we thought we were going to have. I just cannot vote yes when there are so many questions not answered.

Some one is suppose to come talk to us Friday and answer some questions. You can bet I will be the one asking. :eek:

#14 TheVoice

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Posted November 02 2007 - 04:55 AM

I received some information in the mail today. A big copy of the UPS Health Care Dispatch for Part Timers. Everything looks good until you read this: If the information shown in this newsletter differs from this Summary Plan Description (SPD), the SPD will govern.
That tells me that if this contract is ratified, our insurance will move to a plan which may be completely different than what they presented to us before ratification. So, let's see, we do not know what network we'll be under or even if the network will be a local one.
We don't know if our doctors will be part of the network. And to top it all off, we may not have the same insurance we thought we were going to have. I just cannot vote yes when there are so many questions not answered.

Some one is suppose to come talk to us Friday and answer some questions. You can bet I will be the one asking. :-(




Granny,

I got the same thing in the mail here. This still, nor will my local’s attempts to explain away, comfort my opinion of what this really means. If it smells like a duck, walks like a duck, looks like a duck…it’s a duck. Which is why I am going to steer-clear of this weak language by ducking this contract offer. ‘Cause as sure as the day is long, any weak language in the contract is going to benefit the company on this one, and quite frankly, I think the union is aware of how weak it is, and is downplaying it in an effort to steam-roll this thing through the station.

Still voting NO. Good luck finding the information, and please let me know what you find out, cause this issue is also something that is very important to me as well, I am just saddened that not as many people realize there is a problem here. Your concern of the language has reconfirmed to me that I am not the only one that sees it.

Respectfully & fraternally,

The Voice
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#15 GrandmaV

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Posted November 02 2007 - 06:22 PM

The Voice:

We did not have a meeting per say. The big shots were there if anyone wanted to ask questions. I asked about the sentence I pointed out in the last entry. Told them I felt that if we ratified this contract, come January 1, 2008 the insurance coverage we ratified would be null and void. I asked if that is what that statement meant was possible. He said there are always changes in plans. He said this one is modeled after one in effect in Illinois. Said we could go to BCBSIL.com and find out stuff about it. I really do not know how that would help since they still can't tell us whether it will be Aetna or Blue Cross/Blue Shield. And, how would one in Illinois help us?

They said they are trying to get something together that would list network doctors. Couldn't explain, or wouldn't explain, 90%out of area. That's about it

Oh! I decided I am going to vote NO!!

#16 TheVoice

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Posted November 02 2007 - 06:30 PM

The Voice:

We did not have a meeting per say. The big shots were there if anyone wanted to ask questions. I asked about the sentence I pointed out in the last entry. Told them I felt that if we ratified this contract, come January 1, 2008 the insurance coverage we ratified would be null and void. I asked if that is what that statement meant was possible. He said there are always changes in plans. He said this one is modeled after one in effect in Illinois. Said we could go to BCBSIL.com and find out stuff about it. I really do not know how that would help since they still can't tell us whether it will be Aetna or Blue Cross/Blue Shield. And, how would one in Illinois help us?

They said they are trying to get something together that would list network doctors. Couldn't explain, or wouldn't explain, 90%out of area. That's about it

Oh! I decided I am going to vote NO!!


Right on sister! I think your making the right choice. This whole part-timers insurance thing reeks of something fishy. The mer fact that our own union cant, or wont explain this within all certainty, or at least with answers that don’t conflict with what is said in the tentative agreement sends up the Big Red flag. Lets make sure. Lets no push this thing through and then regret it for the next five years.

Respectfully & fraternally,

The Voice

#17 GrandmaV

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Posted November 03 2007 - 08:34 AM

The Voice:

My ballot is in the mail with a NO vote!

I just wanted to tell you that I have read many of your posts and decided that you should not be working at UPS. You should be writing for a living. Your writing is beautiful.

#18 TheVoice

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Posted November 04 2007 - 11:27 AM

The Voice:

My ballot is in the mail with a NO vote!

I just wanted to tell you that I have read many of your posts and decided that you should not be working at UPS. You should be writing for a living. Your writing is beautiful.



You are to kind Granny…thank you for the kind words.

I cant always say that I am consistent though, but sometimes I luck out and arrange the words in a way that gives, the appearance, if nothing else, of being aesthetically pleasing.

Thank you again.

The Voice

#19 Unionguy639

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Posted November 04 2007 - 12:04 PM

A long standing problem I have with the Union is that we sellout the "unborn" teamsters a little more every contract. I am glad you have been able to earn a retirment and I hope you get what you are promised. However I do think that a part time job should never be a path to retirement and that in many cases these part time jobs can and should be combined to create full time jobs. I am not saying that we should have full time car washers making 40k a year, it should only be done in cases where skilled labor is involved and the possiblity to combine those skill jobs exists.

We fought against part time america in 1997 and won. Now we are heading back to square one.

In some cases there are individuals who truly benefit from a part time jobsuch as college students. However for the most part people have part time jobs because their full time job simply does not pay enough to make ends meet. Wouldnt they be so much better off with one decent full time job? A long time ago there were many more full time jobs at UPS, The union sold them in contract concession to benefit current members. The concession for eliminating these jobs was they would still get health care and retirements. Fast forward to 2007 and the company is now saying it doesnt want to provide these benenfits to short term employees, and why should they? It is absurd to provide these benefits to employees that work 3-4 hours a day so this is a logical progression of a sellout made by the union years ago. In this contract they will lose those benefits for part timers until they have been with a company for a long period of time. In time these benefits will be gone altogether and the next GrandmaV will realize they sold there own future a long time ago when they sold out the "unborn" teamsters for a 25 cent raise.

I hope every part and full time employee wakes up and understands the only person we hurt when we short change future teamsters is ourselves.

Work hard, live well, and make lots of money for UPS and your own familys. Then as we make the company richer negotiate for a taste of the sweet pie you had a part in making, just dont let the union save an empty pie tin for its members after it has consumed its fill.
Never argue with an idiot, they will just drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.

#20 TheVoice

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Posted November 04 2007 - 12:12 PM

A long standing problem I have with the Union is that we sellout the "unborn" teamsters a little more every contract. I am glad you have been able to earn a retirment and I hope you get what you are promised. However I do think that a part time job should never be a path to retirement and that in many cases these part time jobs can and should be combined to create full time jobs. I am not saying that we should have full time car washers making 40k a year, it should only be done in cases where skilled labor is involved and the possiblity to combine those skill jobs exists.

We fought against part time america in 1997 and won. Now we are heading back to square one.

In some cases there are individuals who truly benefit from a part time jobsuch as college students. However for the most part people have part time jobs because their full time job simply does not pay enough to make ends meet. Wouldnt they be so much better off with one decent full time job? A long time ago there were many more full time jobs at UPS, The union sold them in contract concession to benefit current members. The concession for eliminating these jobs was they would still get health care and retirements. Fast forward to 2007 and the company is now saying it doesnt want to provide these benenfits to short term employees, and why should they? It is absurd to provide these benefits to employees that work 3-4 hours a day so this is a logical progression of a sellout made by the union years ago. In this contract they will lose those benefits for part timers until they have been with a company for a long period of time. In time these benefits will be gone altogether and the next GrandmaV will realize they sold there own future a long time ago when they sold out the "unborn" teamsters for a 25 cent raise.

I hope every part and full time employee wakes up and understands the only person we hurt when we short change future teamsters is ourselves.

Work hard, live well, and make lots of money for UPS and your own familys. Then as we make the company richer negotiate for a taste of the sweet pie you had a part in making, just dont let the union save an empty pie tin for its members after it has consumed its fill.

Here – Here…I second the motion brought on the floor by brother Unionguy639.

You said it brother.