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IBT STOPS CONTINENTAL AIRLINE MECHANICS CONTRACT VOTE !


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#1 EdHeisler

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Posted November 26 2002 - 10:10 AM


November 22, 2002
(Washington, D.C.) –– International Brotherhood of Teamsters General Counsel Patrick Szymanski today announced that contract ratification ballots returned by Continental Airlines mechanics and related personnel will be voided and that a new contract ratification vote will be scheduled in the near future.

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So what´s going on here? The IBT claims it had to stop the vote because ONLY 45% of Continental mechanics returned their ballots and because the Postal Service didn´t handle the ballots properly!

The IBT declares: "Historically, more than 70% of Teamster airline mechanics vote on a contract ratification. However, ballots representing fewer than 45% of the Teamster members at Continental Airlines were received."

The IBT had no problem counting and proudly announcing that Southwest Airlines mechanics overwhleming approved a new contract when only 100 out of 1,700 mechanics returned ballots.

So, when less than 7% of Southwest mechanics returned their ballots that was just fine. Why? Because 67 mechanics voted for the agreement and 33 against.

But, when "only" 45% of Continental mechanics returned their ballots we suddenly have a major crisis. Could it be that Hoffa´s men in the Airline Division told him to expect a contract rejection if the ballots were counted? Probably. So they will try to sell this contract again in the hopes of getting a YES vote from Continental mechanics the second time around.

Now what about the IBT´s claim that the Postal Service didn´t handle the ballots properly? I think this would be the first time any contract vote has ever been stopped anywhere because the Post Office allegedly didn´t deliver the mail. But, it´s the best excuse the international union could come up to not count the ballots.

The IBT´s legal mouthpiece Szymanski added: “There is reasonable doubt as to the integrity of the process” No doubt about that. And the question of integrity leads straight to the IBT headquarters in Washington, not the U.S. Postal Service.

#2 EdHeisler

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Posted November 26 2002 - 11:37 AM


Does the following statement by the IBT mean they started to count the ballots but didn´t like the way it was going so they stopped?

"The Negotiating Committee was on hand to observe the vote count and unanimously agreed with the decision to halt the process."

#3 dixie

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Posted November 26 2002 - 01:00 PM

Geez, you´d a thought they´ed a sent them ballots UPS. After all, thev got a great contract and are all smiles.

#4 Doug

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Posted November 27 2002 - 03:41 PM

Maybe if more mechanics posted on T-Net we would get their side of the story. Maybe the mechanics don´t give a **** about the Teamsters. Maybe the Continental mechanics wrote in AMFA on the ballots. Or just maybe the Continental mechaics voted "NO" which leaves the question....ARE TEAMSTERS ALLOWED TO REJECT CONTRACTS ANYMORE?

BUILD THE DAMN STRIKE FUND AND LETS STRIKE!

Doug

#5 upsrick1958

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Posted November 27 2002 - 04:24 PM

Kind of sounds like the ballots for the Ups contract. Is the post office screwing up that bad or does Hoofa s boy really suck at counting or being honest????? Half the ups members never got to vote or voted and it never made it to the counters.

#6 EdHeisler

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Posted November 28 2002 - 07:52 PM

The vote was going badly. Most Continental mechanics were probably voting against it.

If it looks like the mechanics are going to vote it down again the Bush ... excuse me ... the Hoffa administration is considering appealing to the Supreme Court to stop the count!

#7 Charlie

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Posted November 29 2002 - 04:21 AM

Ed Heisler, was you at the vote count? I never knew you even worked for the airlines. If you never worked for the airlines then keep your damn mouth out of affairs that don´t concern you.

I can´t wait for the men with white jackets to come for you. We will get a real relief on teamsternet.

#8 dixie

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Posted November 29 2002 - 03:06 PM

M&MorWhat?

#9 dixie

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Posted November 29 2002 - 06:11 PM

Tell me that isn´t jr. in the Ford Tarus commercial?
Paranoid or what?
The driver. Jim Hoffa......er.Ford Tarus. F..
Forgetabout-it.....

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Posted December 03 2002 - 05:18 PM

Ed,You have no idea whatsoever of what you are talking about.Just because you were in the IAH area 5 years ago does not mean you know what is going on.It is ramblings like this that make you have no respect from anyone on these boards.I am at CAL currently and you are totally out of line.You are just spouting hearsays and think that everything you write is fact.If you were truely a Teamster you would not be constantly trying to tear down.Unity Ed,something you may have forgotten.

#11 EdHeisler

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Posted December 03 2002 - 06:33 PM



I´m glad we are finally hearing from at Continental Airlines mechanic. Welcome to TeamsterNet!

Since you are clearly an active IBT member or IBT officer working for Continental you can provide TeamsterNet readers with hard and factual information on what is happening at Continental and Southwest Airlines. So here´s your chance!

Information I have presented on Southwest Airlines and Continental Airlines was obtained from the international union. I didn´t present hearsay and quoted from official statement. If the IBT is publishing misleading, inaccurate, non-factual news or flat-out rumors than you should contact them and demand corrections.

Since your here to get out the truth, please answer a few reasonable questions that trouble many Teamsters.

Can you tell us why a majority of Southwest mechanics have signed Aircraft Mechanics Fraternal Association (AMFA) union authorization cards?

Only 76 mechanics out of 1,700 Southwest mechanics voted in favor of the tentative IBT contract. When less than 6% of Southwest mechanics returned ballots why didn´t GP Hoffa not call for a revote?

The IBT has publicly stated that one of the major reasons why a revote on the tentative Continental agreement is taking place is due to the low return, 45%, on the ballots. Do you think that is true, when General President Hoffa did not call for a revote when only 7% voted on the Southwest contract?

And please clarify the IBT statement that: "The Negotiating Committee was on hand to observe the vote count and unanimously agreed with the decision to halt the process."

Does that mean the IBT actually began to count the ballots and than stopped? That´s the only reasonable conclusion one can draw from the carefully worded statement but perhaps you have a better explanation than the IBT.

And just one final question. Was Ray Benning, the director of our Airline Divison, fired or did he resign because of ill health or other personal reasons? I hope he is in good health. I respected Benning for the good work he did in the Continental organizing drive.

I hope that not a single mechanic signs a AMFA card at Continental. If you worked with me in the Continental organizing drive, you understand why I am worried about what is happening to our Airline Division. I don´t want to see all the hard work that I and many others contributed to the organizing drive go up in dust. I would appreciate it if you would spread the word among mechanics I worked with that I am totally opposed to any raid by any other labor organization.

But, again please tell us what is happening at Continental and Southwest Airlines.

All of us on TeamsterNet look forward to getting regular, factual and hard information from you on what is happening to our Airline Divsion. We need some "facts" from you.

Unfortunately your first post didn´t present any factual information on the points I raised. I´m sure you will correct that oversight in your next post. I look forward to your reply.

Don´t make this just a one time visit now!

One final thing. I have not changed in five years. I believe as strongly today in union solidarity and militancy as you saw demonstrated by me when we worked together five years ago.

So don´t fall for any malarky or rumors you might hear from those who do not have the best interests of Teamsters at heart.


#12 EdHeisler

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Posted December 07 2002 - 09:32 AM


Still waiting for the facts from the anonymous Continental Airlines mechanic.

I hope we hear from the Continental mechanic and/or IBT rep soon ... if in fact it was a Continental mechanic or IBT represented that posted here.

If it was not a bogus post, I´m sure he or she will answer the questions asked with some hard facts.



#13 Floyd

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Posted December 07 2002 - 10:18 AM

i wish all the yes votes for the ups contract would have been delivered to the same place all the yes votes for contientals vote were.

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Posted December 08 2002 - 06:15 PM

Ed,Where you got the info on SWA only voting in favor of the contract of 6% I have no idea.Go to the Teamster website and the vote tally I believe was there.It passed almost 66%.I think you may of missed a 6.They did have a number of SWA techs sign representation cards.I do not work there but from my understanding they have a big problem paying 2.5 times their rate.Amfa is and always will promise the moon and will tell you what you want to hear.In my opinion only, I believe SWA negotiated a decent contract in these times with the current airline situation.Amfa is a stain on the face of true unionism.With the CAL vote they had less than 50% of the ballots at the count.Negotiating members were present at the count and even a few of their ballots were not there.The second envelope of the ballots were never opened so noone knew or knows what the turnout vote was. With IBT legal and everyones input the decision was made to redo the vote because it definitely would not be a true vote if numerous ballots were unaccounted for.Is it strange -yes.Was it a good decision to redo -yes.Does it cause disruption and let all the rumors fly-yes.Is it reason to go into all kind of what-ifs-no.Solidarity and unity is the key to the unions progress and power.If the union membership would be more involved and understand processes and everyday business there would be less turmoil and complaining.I work for CAL and I remember what it was like prior to 1997 and being unrepresented .It sucked.With a lot of hard work and unity we have come an extremely long way.Is everything perfect-Hell no.Is there still a lot of hard work ahead of us for a lifetime-Hell yes.I do not understand a lot of union members.They want everything done for them but want to put in no effort or even pay their dues.I hope SWA comes to their senses and do the right thing and remain IBT but if they go the other route it is going to be very interesting to see how big amfas clout will be.I have not been impressed with their track record.I want to see what people are going to rise up and do all the legwork of running the union.In closing I guess I am just mystified by your posts at times Ed.When we were organizing you preached unity and solidarity but I do not see that in your posts.Carey is gone and from what I have seen it is good.We need to back our union even if we always do not agree 100% with every action.If everything was my way all the time this would be one crazy f/u world.Open your mind up and let us all get back to being true Teamsters-Unity-Strength-Pride!

#15 EdHeisler

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Posted December 08 2002 - 08:55 PM


1. The following is the IBT Press Release on the Southwest Ratification Vote:

Southwest Airlines Mechanics Ratify Contract
Members Vote In Favor of Four-Year Agreement

October 15, 2002

(Washington, D.C.) – Teamster mechanics at Southwest Airlines overwhelmingly ratified a strong four-year contract on Friday, October 11, 2002. The agreement, which passed by a 67-33 margin, covers more than 1,300 mechanics in Dallas, Houston, Phoenix, Chicago, Baltimore and other cities.

2. Unfortunately more "than a number of" SWA techs signed AMFA represenatation cards. A majority have! And that is why there is going to be a representation election on that property.

3. Like your I am also worried about raids on the IBT. And I also want to preserve the gains you and your co-workers made when the Teamsters Union won the representation election five years ago.

That´s why I wrote to another Continental tech:

"I hope that not a single mechanic signs a AMFA card at Continental. If you worked with me in the Continental organizing drive, you understand why I am worried about what is happening to our Airline Division. I don´t want to see all the hard work that I and many others contributed to the organizing drive go up in dust. I would appreciate it if you would spread the word among mechanics I worked with that I am totally opposed to any raid by any other labor organization."

Please read my previous posts in this string carefully.

I continue to preach labor unity and solidarity against our enemies. That´s why I have been harsh on the General Presidents inability or unwillingness to organize the union ranks to unite in action against labors enemies, including the Bush government and its corporate sponsors. We appear to be a leaderless organization right now.

I believe that it is Hoffa´s policies that are causing confusion, division, conflict and disunity within our ranks. We are becoming labors outcasts. Our enemies are taking advantage of someone they believe is a weak and incompetent General President. And that is why the very existence of our once growing Airline Division is now threatened by AMFA and the airline carriers.

We´ve haveto figure out how to stop the bleeding and rebuild the IBT. And to do that we need a radical change in union policies and strategy. The current strategy clearly is not working.

I´d like to answer your questions in more detail and even more importantly learn your thoughts and views on the problems we face.

If you´d like, e-mail me. We can talk one on one.

edheisler2002@yahoo.com






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Posted December 09 2002 - 08:31 AM

Ed,I am with you.Amfa is and always will be out their like the cockroaches that they are.They are not only into raiding the IBT but also the IAM,TWU and any other union that pays dues.Hell the PFAA is in the same building in an adjacent suite with MAG as thier leadersip and advisors.It is easy to promise the rainbow to get someone to vote for you.Amfa has no international leadership and a perfect example is the fiasco amfa had with members working overtime while members are laid off.Amfa represented techs were being laid off before the ink was dry on the contract and prior to 9-11.The independent locals were all going different directions.The problem Ed is getting everyone going the same direction.That is hard to accomplish when we have people bashing anything that goes on and everyone wants it done my way now.Part of effective leadership is getting along and being the glue to keep the membership going in the right direction.Awful hard to do when rocks are being thrown from all sides.I will let it be known up front Ed,TDU does not help with the way they go about their business.I am not and never was one of their followers and can not believe their tear down and smear campaign tactics.If everything is in turmoil it is easy to divide and conqer.Maybe instead of bashing we can all get on the same page and work together to move forward.Remember the union is not the enemy.Unity-Strength-Pride!It says it all.P.S.-By the way I think the press release you refer to was in percentages on the numbers,not actual votes.It was approved on a 2 to 1 margin.A lot of SWA people have been promised if you sign a ballot amfa will come and talk to you but not till they had the cards signed.They do not have the money or the manpower to enforce and bargain on the people they represent currently let alone to try to organize new members.It is all coming from disgruntled I want everything for me,me,me members.The union is only as good as its members!

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Posted December 09 2002 - 09:32 AM

I would suggest you be very leery of providing Ed Heisler your e-mail or having correspondence with him via e-mail. He has been known to provide e-mail addresses to the NRTW and you may wind up on the NRTW mailing list. Ed Heisler is a cockroach trying to impersonate a union tradesman.

#18 EdHeisler

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Posted December 09 2002 - 01:15 PM


Just more nonsense from someone who cannot discuss and debate union issues on TeamsterNet. He or she probably also thinks the Continental organizing drive was some grand National Right To Work (NRTW) committee plot.