120 replies to this topic

[BigUnionGuy]

-scb-

When I have the chance or time, will check the archives as to your comments and or suggestions. Fair enough ?

"ect... the usual Teamsters justifications."

Thats a "member" mentality. And they speak of it.

Your next two (2) paragraphs kind of spell it out. You and I, both know the truth. Not a popular conclusion.

Lastly, "the NMFA a dead letter" come on.... deregulation. And the Teamsters did it ??

You have layed-out, on other occasions, what you thought.

UPS would "naturally give"..... No. Its not in the Companys interest to "give" anything, but to themselves. You had to work for it....

Here I have been, thinking you might be a voice of reason.... but now seemingly.... jumping on the APWA bandwagon.

Its not hard to fathom why.....

Here is a thought.... some or most people can't understand.

The principal of delayed gratification.


Think about it.



-Bug-

[scb]

-BUG-

One quick comment. For all you rhetoric, you seem to have forgotten that it was the *company* that invited the Teamster's in their midst.....it wasn't a position the Teamsters "earned" by any stretch of the imagination.

As for my "jumping on the APWA bandwagon", I think I've made it perfectly clear that I'm not a proponent of that movement (Dare I ask it? Have you caught that so stereotypically Teamster "disease" of "jumping to conclusions as well?...grin!). Far from it; in fact, I see no reason for anyone to jump out of the frying pan into the fire. Much better, from my perspective, to jump with a purpose.......and clear the heat altogether.

Not sure where you're coming from with your other rather mysterious statements, other than to note that they don't seem to rebut the accuracy of mine. For example, the NMFA....are you seriously going to contend that it's anywhere's NEAR the force that it was a few decades ago?

Sorry....but facts are facts. And, as has been my contention all along, the longer the Teamsters insist on keeping their heads buried in the sand and ignoring those facts - and refusing to address them - the closer they come to total irrelevancy. I'd submit that these latest musings by IBT apologists against this weak-kneed ad hoc APWA "competion" - and the scatter-brained fervor with which they're shotgunned forth - amply demonstrates the truth of that contention.

But, as always, you're free to make your own choice. If you're comfortable with what the Teamsters have accomplished, and are "on track" to accomplish, then have it your way. Just be advised that the rest of the world doesn't seem to be inclined to follow that course into unreality, or feel the need to particularly accomodate those who do.

-scb-

[attaboy]

"100 million dollar exclusion on pension contributions"

I try to imagine what our future would look like if UPS hadn't taken this bribe by the union. Lets face it, $100 Mil, to a company the size of UPS is basicly chicken feed. It's definetly chicken feed to the company's current unfunded liability. My guess is that faced with more and more workers crossing the picket lines Carey would have been forced to allow a vote on contract that would have effectivly partitioned the funds. With the threat of Billions of dollars of liability gone, UPS could focus more on the competition, the workers would have more secure footing in their pensions, and the Teamsters would be reduced to what the APWA wants to be.

[TeamsterOne35]

The real reason that unions are having such a hard time in this country is because big business (like UPS) owns the government at all levels. Some 57 million workers in America say they would join a union tomorrow if they could. But the problem is the USA (along with South Africa) has the worst labor laws in the WORLD.

Prettry pathetic if you ask me. Over 10,000 workers that attempt to join a union are fired each year (which is illegal) but because of the stalling tactics and lack of any real penalties against companies for breaking the law, it is the preferred tactic to use to fight any organizing drive. That is why there aren't more union members in America. Let's not blame it all on the unions. Pass a law that says that companies need to stay neutral during organizing drives and that violations would land the lawbreakers in jail on a mandatory basis and watch the union membership numbers boom!

[upsgreedvsthemselves]

AMEN BROTHER !!!!!!!!!!! There will be a labor revolution in this country. Sorry apwa but you're not the answer. As things get worse ,and they will, only then will workers stand up and make Washington listen. Bush, the idiot on strings has set America back 60 years. We barely showed life again after Reagan set us back to the late 30's. Deregulation and trickle down economics killed this country not the unions. Yes the unions have their faults but with all their faults,unions have done more for humanity than any other organization that ever existed.They have done more for decency,for education,for the developing of character than any other association.Ten thousand times the labor movement has stumbled and fallen and bruised itself and risen again,been seized by the throat and choked into insensibility,enjoined by courts,assaulted by the press,frowned on by public opinion,decieved by politicians,infested by spies,deserted by cowards,betrayed by traitors,bled by leeches;but not withstanding all this, it is still the most vital power this planet has ever known; and its historic mission of emancipating the workers of the world is as certain a realization as the rising and setting of the sun. Yes the working world will wake up and unfortunatly it will be after things worsen but it will happen and it will be ugly.The pendulum only swings so far and then it goes the other way.Bush and his big business buddies know it's coming, thats why the companies are taking all the security measures in the workplace.Terrorist my ass, they're scared of the common worker getting pissed off and doing something drastic. The information age can tell uncle sam everything about anyone. They don't need to take all the precautions. Their objective is to keep the worker down and scared.

[sawman]

The APWA might not be the answer for freight or carhaulers, or anyone else outside UPS, but the APWA is and will be the answer for the UPS workers.

[krash]

Then the question must be "Who's gonna attempt to destroy organized labor at UPS?"

[BigUnionGuy]

Ah yes....

The APWA is such a resounding success....

At their "last" meeting.... after soliciting an entire state.... they were able to garner a whopping eleven (11) *members* to listen to their spiel.

One of who which, thought is was a meeting of the Central States.


Who's trying to fool who ???


-Bug-

[UPSSup]

my you guys even got the labor revolution nuts fired up on this one. good job.

[upsgreedvsthemselves]

That's funny the only nuts at UPS are wearing ties. Like the one they caught riding around a college campus exposing himself. Or the ones operating an escort service out of one of the hubs. Or the one who tried ripping off the pup carrying cod turn ins. Or the hundreds who have left their wives to run off with clerks. Or the one who put a hidden camera in the locker room to watch other guys dressing. Most of these guys had 20 plus years in. I guess when your taught how to lie and fudge numbers so you look good, you get the idea you can do just about anything. Thats nuts !!!

[sawman]

Gained 11 members out of just one meeting, that's pretty good!

There are a lot of people in my area that say they are waiting for the local and international Teamster elections so that they can vote the incumbants out, and then resign and join the APWA.

[101st_Airborne]

BigUnionDope,

"Fully admit" Fully admit"

Why don't you "fully admit" you don't understand what "fully admit means." Least you wear out the statement without 1 iota of proof of it.

[BigUnionGuy]

101st_Airhead,

We are all still waiting to hear about your "honorable" discharge.....



-Bug-

[krash]

sawman said:

There are a lot of people in my area that say they are waiting for the local and international Teamster elections so that they can vote the incumbants out, and then resign and join the APWA.

That doesnt make one bit of sence. If there ready to bail, there not gonna care about voting someone out.

[sawman]

It doesn't make much since to me either, but I here it all the time.
This is how much distain UPSers in my area have for the powers that be, in the Teamsters union. They say all the time that if they are unsuccessful at voting them out then they are gone.

[upsgreedvsthemselves]

Idiot 101 and Sawdust, You two are legends in your own minds. Your apwa will die on the vine. Your motto should be, " We're looking for a few stupid men." Because thats all you'll get. The only ones you'll get are the uninformed and frustrated. If their prospective locals are not getting the job done they have to look no farther than their own mirrors. Once again apwa is not the answer !! UPS people are notoious for waiting until it's too late to fix something. They're too busy to go to union meetings. They expect someone else to do their fighting for them just because they pay dues. It's no different than americans paying taxes and expecting their representatives to do the right things. It doesn't happen unless people get involved. As far as their pensions the horse is already out of the barn. Apwa will not change a thing. It will only dupe some uninformed frustrated people into giving you two frauds more money.

[sawman]

Upsgreed,

That's your opinion, and you know what they say about opinions!

Fact of the matter is that the Teamsters want last at UPS much past 2008. so you had better be looking for some sort of organized representation to take there place, or else UPS will eat you alive.
If it 's not the APWA, you better find something because time is short.

[upsbrother]

11 new members, eh? So that brings you to 13? Only 110,000 to go! You are aware that the IBT has added thousands of new UPS members in "right to work for less" states, right? FYI, around here 99.9 % of the workers have never even heard of your bullshit. And we ain't that far away, as the feeder flys. Those who have heard think its bullshit. Teamsters are doing just fine here, thanks. Full time jobs coming fast and furious, the PT wait is down to a year, pension is solid, H&W is the best, company is paying grievances on sups working, one guy got 22 pay penalties for a one time $160 shortage, you have to pretty much commit a crime on-duty to get fired. What is not to love?

[BigUnionGuy]

sawman,

I think everyone is in tune to your reference of opinions....

They are alot like the APWA.


To quote you: "the Teamsters want last at UPS"

Nice verbiage. Didn't you mean won't ?? What a command of the english language. Kind of a scary thought.... that you, mud, and 101_st, would even consider propagating this nonsense when you have NO experience at all.

"Gained 11 new members" ?? No.... Thats how many showed up.... from an entire state.

Seems that the $150.00 "donation" is what is paying for the APWA to travel around.... Remember.... No Refunds.



-Bug-

[sawman]

Brain washed, Teamster lap dogs!
The roof is going to come crashing down on your heads in 2008, and you are to narrow minded to see the cracks in the ceiling!

Upsbrother,

You got yours, so screw everyone else! Stay locked up in your little world, where ever that might be. Your fund is just another example of what we all should have, and we are going to get it, so sit back in your easy chair and watch.