You can't just go out and create a Union out of the blue. You are under the obligation of the Constitution of the International Brotherhood of Teamsters. First, under Article XX (20) of the IBT Constitution your Local Union can not dissolve without the approval of the General Executive Board. Second, you would have to petition for a Decertification Vote for your entire facility. Now, your chances of getting either to happen are slim and none. I am fortunate, I am a New York State Teamster. Our Pensions are out of this world and our health care is the best I have ever had (no one can match either). Central States got a royal screw job, but you elected your Union Officials into those positions. I do not know what to say but this. Get those con-artists out and elect someone that will fight for your membership. Take care.
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126 replies to this topic
#61
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- Location:UPS Syracuse, New York
- Local Union Number:317
#62
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Posted March 03 2005 - 06:32 AM
Pac317,
Just how much is your pension, and what kind of health benifits do you have?
As far as the royal screw job in Central States,
AMEN TO THAT!
As for booting out the officers, How many officers are in a 27 state plan? It's not just one or two locals, Central States covers half the country.
I guess you would have to start at the top, with MR. HOFFA,
But then your under MR. HOFFA also.
Got any other suggestions!
Just how much is your pension, and what kind of health benifits do you have?
As far as the royal screw job in Central States,
AMEN TO THAT!
As for booting out the officers, How many officers are in a 27 state plan? It's not just one or two locals, Central States covers half the country.
I guess you would have to start at the top, with MR. HOFFA,
But then your under MR. HOFFA also.
Got any other suggestions!
#63
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- Location:UPS Syracuse, New York
- Local Union Number:317
Posted March 03 2005 - 08:56 AM
The average Pension Check here in NY for a UPS Retiree is around 6500-7000 a month (today). My health care, I have full Optical, Medical, and Dental. All I pay is pretty much is Union Dues. It sounds like that Central States have too many hands in the "cookie jar". I understand that your upset and you should be. Turn that anger in to ambition. Go to the IBT and demand answers, go to the Government and demand answers. Get petitions out, file official charges with the IBT and NLRB. Don't give up fighting. Throwing your hands up and leaving the Union isn't the answer. Your giving up too easily. Go down evey avenue and keep your Union Officials and Government Officials on their toes. You have the right to demand reform and information. Keep fighting and down give up. If you need somebody to vent to drop me a e-mail, I will listen. We have a great Health and Welfare Committee here and I believe that the IBT should appoint some of them to go to Central States and help out. I know you may think I am a "butt kissing" SOB. I am far from that. I am always pushing my Union Officials for information and action. They get it done here. Contact me if you just want to talk about anything. Keep fighting your brother and sisters will stand by you, if they don't they don't deserve to be Teamsters.
#64
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Posted March 03 2005 - 02:00 PM
Support the Campaign
NAME_________________________________________
ADDRESS_____________________________________
CITY____________________STATE________ZIP_____
PHONE_______________________________________
E-MAIL_____________________LOCAL UNION_______
EMPLOYER____________________________________
P.O. BOX 8131, GREENSBORO, NC 27419
WWW.NOPENSIONFREEZE.ORG
770-723-7217
Teamsters have been hit by some nasty cuts in pension
accruals. In the Central States the situation is worst of all,
with drastic cuts made to our retiree health coverage. The
leadership of the International Union and the union pension
trustees act like they own our pension plan.
Many Teamsters are organizing to strengthen our funds
and benefits. But other folks have a different idea: that
UPSers should just get out of the union benefit funds altogether
and supposedly get better pensions in the process.
They say that UPS could run the pension plan for its
employees, perhaps more like an IRA or 401(k). Another
group is calling for getting out of Central States, and the
union, altogether.
Smoke and Mirrors
The employers are using a simple and nasty trick in
order to deceive members and derail reform efforts.
Claims that you would get more money by getting out
of our pension plan commonly use the same slight of hand:
they compare today’s pension to a hypothetical future pension
under a company or separate plan.
We checked out an organization called ItsMyMap (It’s
My Money And Pension) as a perfect example of this procompany
trick. They promise that if UPSers decertify the
Teamsters and join their association, a new hire today
could retire in 30 years with a pension of $7,000 per
month.
Wow, $7,000 a month, that sounds good! But notice the
trick: that’s 30 years from now, not today.
Thirty years ago the Central States Fund paid a small
fraction of $3,000 to retirees. The employers contributed
Empty Promises of Big Benefits
Get Out or Drop Out and We All Lose Out
only pennies per hour. As recently as 1990, CSPF paid
$1,000 per month for 30-and-out. In 1991, with TDU
organizing the movement, members won an increase from
$1000 a month to $2000 a month. We doubled the pension
overnight, with Teamsters working together as Teamsters
to demand change.
Pension improvements came about because Teamsters
demanded that pensions be improved, and ranked pensions
high in bargaining priorities.
That’s why UPS now has to contribute $9,880 per year
to your pension fund.
Thirty years from now the Central States Fund will be
paying as much or more than what is promised by those
who say we should abandon the
fund. In fact, just restoring the 2%
multiplier will get many Teamsters
close to the $7,000 mark when they
finally retire.
So projecting 30 years into the
future, then comparing to today’s
benefits, is a cheap trick.
What Is the Answer?
The answer is not
to separate our pension
plans, which would
weaken our union and
leave us at the mercy of
management.
The answer is to
strengthen our union
and our pension plan.
We can send delegates
to the Teamster
Convention in 2006
committed to pension
accountability, reform,
and new leadership for
our pension funds. It
worked before, and it
will work again.
We won decent
pensions through collective
action. Our collective
action can now
restore the cuts and
protect our pensions far
into the future.
Union-
Buster
Beware of
Union-Busting
Attorneys
The ItsMyMap group
advertises as their counsel and
advisor a management attorney,
Francis T. (Tom) Coleman. His
law firm specializes in beating
unions. A trip to their website
(www.wmcd.com) reveals articles
on how to attack unions
and on turning the tide against
unions.
They list as some of their
accomplishments: “represented
clients in decertification of
unions...defeated union organizing
attempts...negotiated several
long-term agreements,
including work rule and health
insurance concessions for
Fortune 500 companies.”
Is this law firm going to
safeguard your pension and
health coverage, when they
brag about forcing health concessions
on workers?
NAME_________________________________________
ADDRESS_____________________________________
CITY____________________STATE________ZIP_____
PHONE_______________________________________
E-MAIL_____________________LOCAL UNION_______
EMPLOYER____________________________________
P.O. BOX 8131, GREENSBORO, NC 27419
WWW.NOPENSIONFREEZE.ORG
770-723-7217
Teamsters have been hit by some nasty cuts in pension
accruals. In the Central States the situation is worst of all,
with drastic cuts made to our retiree health coverage. The
leadership of the International Union and the union pension
trustees act like they own our pension plan.
Many Teamsters are organizing to strengthen our funds
and benefits. But other folks have a different idea: that
UPSers should just get out of the union benefit funds altogether
and supposedly get better pensions in the process.
They say that UPS could run the pension plan for its
employees, perhaps more like an IRA or 401(k). Another
group is calling for getting out of Central States, and the
union, altogether.
Smoke and Mirrors
The employers are using a simple and nasty trick in
order to deceive members and derail reform efforts.
Claims that you would get more money by getting out
of our pension plan commonly use the same slight of hand:
they compare today’s pension to a hypothetical future pension
under a company or separate plan.
We checked out an organization called ItsMyMap (It’s
My Money And Pension) as a perfect example of this procompany
trick. They promise that if UPSers decertify the
Teamsters and join their association, a new hire today
could retire in 30 years with a pension of $7,000 per
month.
Wow, $7,000 a month, that sounds good! But notice the
trick: that’s 30 years from now, not today.
Thirty years ago the Central States Fund paid a small
fraction of $3,000 to retirees. The employers contributed
Empty Promises of Big Benefits
Get Out or Drop Out and We All Lose Out
only pennies per hour. As recently as 1990, CSPF paid
$1,000 per month for 30-and-out. In 1991, with TDU
organizing the movement, members won an increase from
$1000 a month to $2000 a month. We doubled the pension
overnight, with Teamsters working together as Teamsters
to demand change.
Pension improvements came about because Teamsters
demanded that pensions be improved, and ranked pensions
high in bargaining priorities.
That’s why UPS now has to contribute $9,880 per year
to your pension fund.
Thirty years from now the Central States Fund will be
paying as much or more than what is promised by those
who say we should abandon the
fund. In fact, just restoring the 2%
multiplier will get many Teamsters
close to the $7,000 mark when they
finally retire.
So projecting 30 years into the
future, then comparing to today’s
benefits, is a cheap trick.
What Is the Answer?
The answer is not
to separate our pension
plans, which would
weaken our union and
leave us at the mercy of
management.
The answer is to
strengthen our union
and our pension plan.
We can send delegates
to the Teamster
Convention in 2006
committed to pension
accountability, reform,
and new leadership for
our pension funds. It
worked before, and it
will work again.
We won decent
pensions through collective
action. Our collective
action can now
restore the cuts and
protect our pensions far
into the future.
Union-
Buster
Beware of
Union-Busting
Attorneys
The ItsMyMap group
advertises as their counsel and
advisor a management attorney,
Francis T. (Tom) Coleman. His
law firm specializes in beating
unions. A trip to their website
(www.wmcd.com) reveals articles
on how to attack unions
and on turning the tide against
unions.
They list as some of their
accomplishments: “represented
clients in decertification of
unions...defeated union organizing
attempts...negotiated several
long-term agreements,
including work rule and health
insurance concessions for
Fortune 500 companies.”
Is this law firm going to
safeguard your pension and
health coverage, when they
brag about forcing health concessions
on workers?
#66
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Member
Posted March 03 2005 - 06:57 PM
[quote=Feeders]
Pac317
The Upstate New York Fund slashed in half the formula for determining future pension benefit accruals. Your notice is already in the mail! Sorry to be the one to break the news.
Feeders, do you have any association with Frank Bryant or Tommy Burke? Just another question that no one probably wants to answer.
Pac317
The Upstate New York Fund slashed in half the formula for determining future pension benefit accruals. Your notice is already in the mail! Sorry to be the one to break the news.
Feeders, do you have any association with Frank Bryant or Tommy Burke? Just another question that no one probably wants to answer.
#67
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Posted March 03 2005 - 08:59 PM
Those numbers I posted are the Pensions for a UPS Retiree today passed along by a friend of mine. My pension statement with a 30 year pension is forcasted to be much higher than that. I just read about the Pension Issue. You can believe that there will be a lot of pissed off Teamsters looking for answers.
#68
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Member
Posted March 03 2005 - 09:17 PM
Teamsterman,
Did you read the post by PAC317, right before your last post. He is from NY, And they get $6500- $7000 a month right now with full optical, dental, and medical.
So it seems that the APWA benifit package is not unrealistic after all.
As far as the 30 years from now that you speak of. You are wrong to think that we will be getting that kind of pension in the central Sates fund in 30 more years.
Let me use myself as an example:
I have 23 years in now, I am 42 years old.
The first three years were part time, Amount unknown, we think $50.00 per year, total- $150.00
the next 19 years fulltime at $100.00 Acrual rate, total- 1900.00 plus the $150.00 part time, Total- $2050.00.
The last year at $50.00 acrual rate(after pension cuts).
Total $2100.00
That's 2100.oo for 23 years service.
I'm 42 years old, so I have 20 years to go to make the 62 year ritirement age.
20 years at $50.00 acrual rate, total $1000.00 plus the $2100.00
Total $3100.00 for 43 years of service, and that is 20 years from now.
Now take that 3100.00 and deduct $510.00 for your health care and $510.00 for your wife per month, $1020.00 a month (and it goes up $100.00 each year).
3100.00 minus 1020.00, Total= $2080.00
2080.00 minus serv. benifit of 400.00 a month
Total=$1680.00
if you use an estimated tax of 20%
Final total bring home pension:
$1344.00 a month for 43 years of service.
What will the cost of living be in 20 more years? I doubt that 1344.00 will go very far.
Did you read the post by PAC317, right before your last post. He is from NY, And they get $6500- $7000 a month right now with full optical, dental, and medical.
So it seems that the APWA benifit package is not unrealistic after all.
As far as the 30 years from now that you speak of. You are wrong to think that we will be getting that kind of pension in the central Sates fund in 30 more years.
Let me use myself as an example:
I have 23 years in now, I am 42 years old.
The first three years were part time, Amount unknown, we think $50.00 per year, total- $150.00
the next 19 years fulltime at $100.00 Acrual rate, total- 1900.00 plus the $150.00 part time, Total- $2050.00.
The last year at $50.00 acrual rate(after pension cuts).
Total $2100.00
That's 2100.oo for 23 years service.
I'm 42 years old, so I have 20 years to go to make the 62 year ritirement age.
20 years at $50.00 acrual rate, total $1000.00 plus the $2100.00
Total $3100.00 for 43 years of service, and that is 20 years from now.
Now take that 3100.00 and deduct $510.00 for your health care and $510.00 for your wife per month, $1020.00 a month (and it goes up $100.00 each year).
3100.00 minus 1020.00, Total= $2080.00
2080.00 minus serv. benifit of 400.00 a month
Total=$1680.00
if you use an estimated tax of 20%
Final total bring home pension:
$1344.00 a month for 43 years of service.
What will the cost of living be in 20 more years? I doubt that 1344.00 will go very far.
#69
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Member
Posted March 03 2005 - 09:25 PM
Oh, by the way,
A lot of people are just now learning that Central States has made more cuts to our health care.
Major medical now has a $200.00 deductable, AND only pays 80%, you are responsable for the other 20%, the hospitals are asking for that 20% up front!
A lot of people are just now learning that Central States has made more cuts to our health care.
Major medical now has a $200.00 deductable, AND only pays 80%, you are responsable for the other 20%, the hospitals are asking for that 20% up front!
#70
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Member
Posted March 05 2005 - 10:56 PM
sawman said:
Teamsterman,
Did you read the post by PAC317, right before your last post. He is from NY, And they get $6500- $7000 a month right now with full optical, dental, and medical.
So it seems that the APWA benifit package is not unrealistic after all.
As far as the 30 years from now that you speak of. You are wrong to think that we will be getting that kind of pension in the central Sates fund in 30 more years.
Let me use myself as an example:
I have 23 years in now, I am 42 years old.
The first three years were part time, Amount unknown, we think $50.00 per year, total- $150.00
the next 19 years fulltime at $100.00 Acrual rate, total- 1900.00 plus the $150.00 part time, Total- $2050.00.
The last year at $50.00 acrual rate(after pension cuts).
Total $2100.00
That's 2100.oo for 23 years service.
I'm 42 years old, so I have 20 years to go to make the 62 year ritirement age.
20 years at $50.00 acrual rate, total $1000.00 plus the $2100.00
Total $3100.00 for 43 years of service, and that is 20 years from now.
Now take that 3100.00 and deduct $510.00 for your health care and $510.00 for your wife per month, $1020.00 a month (and it goes up $100.00 each year).
3100.00 minus 1020.00, Total= $2080.00
2080.00 minus serv. benifit of 400.00 a month
Total=$1680.00
if you use an estimated tax of 20%
Final total bring home pension:
$1344.00 a month for 43 years of service.
What will the cost of living be in 20 more years? I doubt that 1344.00 will go very far.
Did you read the post by PAC317, right before your last post. He is from NY, And they get $6500- $7000 a month right now with full optical, dental, and medical.
So it seems that the APWA benifit package is not unrealistic after all.
As far as the 30 years from now that you speak of. You are wrong to think that we will be getting that kind of pension in the central Sates fund in 30 more years.
Let me use myself as an example:
I have 23 years in now, I am 42 years old.
The first three years were part time, Amount unknown, we think $50.00 per year, total- $150.00
the next 19 years fulltime at $100.00 Acrual rate, total- 1900.00 plus the $150.00 part time, Total- $2050.00.
The last year at $50.00 acrual rate(after pension cuts).
Total $2100.00
That's 2100.oo for 23 years service.
I'm 42 years old, so I have 20 years to go to make the 62 year ritirement age.
20 years at $50.00 acrual rate, total $1000.00 plus the $2100.00
Total $3100.00 for 43 years of service, and that is 20 years from now.
Now take that 3100.00 and deduct $510.00 for your health care and $510.00 for your wife per month, $1020.00 a month (and it goes up $100.00 each year).
3100.00 minus 1020.00, Total= $2080.00
2080.00 minus serv. benifit of 400.00 a month
Total=$1680.00
if you use an estimated tax of 20%
Final total bring home pension:
$1344.00 a month for 43 years of service.
What will the cost of living be in 20 more years? I doubt that 1344.00 will go very far.
Yeah sawman, I read the post. But just about all the funds are cutting benefits. Some just took a little longer, even the ones that are UPS only. Look at the Magellan fund that recently got cut from our 401K. They weren't doing to well either. When 911 happened everyone took a hit. My 401K lost half its value, but I left it alone and it's doing nicely now.
Sawman, I have no doubt that your heart is in the right place. I don't like the cuts either. But can you honesty tell me that if you had your fund established when 911 happened that it wouldn't have affected your fund? Central States took a big hit because it's a large fund and they where to heaviley(sp) weighted in stocks and other risky investments.
The best thing we could hope for now is get the fund partitioned, get the laws changed to where they would be classified as a single employer fund after they are partitioned. And I think UPS supports that idea. The money UPS puts into these funds should go to UPS people. I get alot of flack at work for saying that, but times are changing and we need to change with them.
I won't support your union, but I will support your ideas. If you can rock the boat to get things rolling, then power to you. But "we" can't just walk away from the Teamsters Union. My father and grandfather built this union so we could have one voice. If you splitter it and divide it then no one has a voice. It's called union busting. Hopefully we can have unity and reform instead of division and destruction. I think we agree on the problems, we just disagree on the solutions.
#74
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Veteran Member
Posted March 06 2005 - 11:50 PM
When most negative comments are directed towards Teamster pension programs, they invariably refer to Central States. Yet, no one ever mentions that the entire investment program of CS is court controlled and directed. The goverment took over amidst a lot of accusations of Teamster mob penetrations and inappropriate loans and fees. Ever since they took over its been going downhill and some horendous investments ( in which Union/Teamster officials were completely uninvolved or even allowed to be involved in) such as the 'Russian Bank fiasco' have attracted virtually no attention.
Now the antis use the misfortunes (CS with its goverment appointed money managers is the worst managed of all the major Teamster pension funds, most of whom are doing very well under difficult circumstances) of this pensions fund to further malign our Union. Its like the guy that takes a $hit in a room while stating that the place stinks. You even get absolute idiots like this most recent group that do not have the fogiest idea of what a Union or a pension program is all about bad mouthing us while they pimp and pander for anti Union consultants. I can tolerate pimps and whores and understand that unfortunately, they are a part of life, but what is hard to accept is our members tolerance for these kind of assh@le bad mouth artists to the point where they alot them credibility.
alex y.
Now the antis use the misfortunes (CS with its goverment appointed money managers is the worst managed of all the major Teamster pension funds, most of whom are doing very well under difficult circumstances) of this pensions fund to further malign our Union. Its like the guy that takes a $hit in a room while stating that the place stinks. You even get absolute idiots like this most recent group that do not have the fogiest idea of what a Union or a pension program is all about bad mouthing us while they pimp and pander for anti Union consultants. I can tolerate pimps and whores and understand that unfortunately, they are a part of life, but what is hard to accept is our members tolerance for these kind of assh@le bad mouth artists to the point where they alot them credibility.
alex y.
#78
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Hardcore Member
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Posted March 08 2005 - 09:24 AM
Teamterman it does look like you are figting hard to hold onto to the status quo. Of the 21 multi-employer pension plans ups pays into. 11 are 75 percent funded or less with central states the worst one. Central states is the worst around 60 to 65 percent funded. You folks have a real pension crisis and when you start asking questions why you should use the NY pension that pays close to 7000 K a month as your benchmark.
#79
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Posted March 08 2005 - 07:26 PM
UPSSup said:
Teamterman it does look like you are figting hard to hold onto to the status quo. Of the 21 multi-employer pension plans ups pays into. 11 are 75 percent funded or less with central states the worst one. Central states is the worst around 60 to 65 percent funded. You folks have a real pension crisis and when you start asking questions why you should use the NY pension that pays close to 7000 K a month as your benchmark.
Last time I looked, Central States was 62 percent funded (which is crisis mode). I don't think I've ever disagreed that point. Isn't the company's in these multi-employer plan responsible for 100% funding? What about partitioning the fund? What about combining all the funds into one (that one alone would probably save billions in administrative costs). And didn't the NY fund just cut their benefits by half? And isn't that a UPSer fund? I don't know all the answers, I'm the one asking the questions. No one seems to be willing to answer them. But if you think I'm going to follow this APWA crowd into oblivion(sp) then your all nuts.
Status quo? Maybe. But I'm not ready to throw everything I've worked for away on the promises of a couple nuts that promote a union busting firm as their savior. Fighting hard? You god damn right I'm fighting hard.
